DRAFT FILED: 11/30/04
FINAL APPROVAL 12/22/04
VILLAGE OF CROTON-ON-HUDSON, N.Y. WATER CONTROL COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES OF NOVEMBER 17, 2004
MEMBERS PRESENT: Stuart Greenbaum, Chairman
Mark Goldfarb
Mary Cain
Jason Stern
Vita Rhodes
The meeting came to order at 7:30 P.M.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES:
10/6/04 - Greenbaum - Made Motion to accept the minutes as corrected
Cain - Second the Motion
Vote: 5-0 In Favor
HEARINGS:
Galina Feit/American Bldg. Technologies, Located at Prospect & Old Post Rd. So. Designated on the Tax Maps of the Village as Section 67.20 Block 4 Lot 19. Request for a Wetlands Activity Permit with respect to proposed Hudson View Subdivision and Section 230-3-(H) of the Wetlands Ordinance. (Adj. on 10/6/04).
The applicant was not present
Dan O'Connor, Village Engineer - Bartilucci promised a proposal for the drainage analysis. We have not received it yet, but the applicant is verbally committed to proceeding with additional drainage analysis. Bartilucci hopes to have the report to us by
the next WCC meeting on December 15, 2004. The WCC will then be able to make their decision.
The Board agreed to adjourn the hearing until December 15, 2004.
Hearing Adjourned.
Edward G. Cable, Located at 5A Warren Road. Designated on the Tax Maps of the Village as Section 67.14 Block 2 Lot 1. Request for a Wetlands Activity Permit with respect to a proposed in-ground pool (adj. on 10/6/04)
The applicant Edward Cable and his project manager Dave Ferman were present at the hearing.
Cable - I requested the Board to review plans prepared by Ralph Mastromonico for an in-ground pool behind my house. The plans were incomplete. The plans were completed by Ralph Mastromonico and submitted to the Board for this evenings meeting.
Mr. Cable also submitted pictures for the record showing the location of the proposed pool.
O'Connor - Is the grading that is shown on the plan what exists currently and the pool will be the same that you applied for; nothing has changed as far as design?
Cable - No.
Cable -When I built my house I thought the survey submitted with the building permit application showed the proposed pool. I did not realize that the plans that were approved were not the plans that showed the pool, but plans that I submitted prior to that which did not show the pool. The pool is in the exact same place. It is my own fault. I thought it was clear that it was in the exact same place as the other plans.
Rhodes - There is no key mapped on this plan. What is this area down here…?
Discussion followed over plans.
Cable - I am adjacent to the railroad. There will be no blasting involved. This area was created by me when I constructed the property with the intention of building the pool.
Discussion followed over plans as to the wetland location.
Cable - There is a tiny stream that runs over route nine. I have no neighbors' only one neighbor on one side of me.
Discussion followed over plans with respect to location of neighbors and the location of drainage fields and septic fields.
Cable - I have two one thousand gallon tanks. When I developed the house I developed it with the intention of this area being used for the pool.
Cable - Whatever I need It will not disturb the wetlands
Greenbaum - Questioned the location of the area of disturbance.
Discussion followed over pictures and plans.
Cable - I have about eight to twelve feet before the steepest part of the pool will be. The dimension of the pool will be sixteen ft. by forty ft.
Rhodes - Is this picture to scale?
Cable - No.
Rhodes - Did you stake it out?
Cable - Yes I did stake it out to guarantee that I would be able to build my house. The village has the plan for it. I purchased the property from Mark Giordano. This whole area had to be excavated and I had to extend the driveway and build a road to the site. I used Mark Giordano to excavate the property and everything was landscaped.
Rhodes - Were you aware at the time of construction that you were in the wetland area.
Cable - I originally did not think so, but 1 ? months ago I realized it was not so.
Rhodes-That plan was submitted before you excavated and built the house?
Cable - There was an as-built and there was a new survey done by Mastromonico. I was prepared to do this at the last meeting but Ralph Mastromonico wanted to do an additional survey to make sure the figures were correct. If you want to know anything specific to the pool you can discuss it with my project engineer who is with me tonight.
Greenbaum - I would like to discuss with the village engineer what you originally submitted and what you are submitting now.
Cable - I thought I had everything I needed until I checked with the village.
Rhodes - What is the depth of the pool?
Cable - Three to five feet in the middle and back to three feet. There is no diving board.
Rhodes - Is it an in-ground pool?
Cable - Yes but the pool is self supportive and my engineer can explain..
Ferman - For down hill retention it is engineered so we can build above the ground, if we wanted. In this case we do not want to.
Goldfarb - It is twenty to thirty feet into the buffer zone.
Discussion followed over plans.
Cable - I have a drywell with a storm drain and in this area (referring to plans) is rip rap
Greenbaum - So when you drain the pool you will drain about a one third of it?
Cable - We have separation tanks for the back washing it is a three hundred gallon tank and it has a 4 ft. x 4 ft. concrete drywell.
Discussion followed over plans.
Cable - I am very conscious of water-flow and drainage and erosion.
Rhodes - It might be helpful if you stake out the area.
Greenbaum - Since we only received the plans yesterday we would like to have a site visit. When would you like to start construction?
Ferman - Immediately.
Rhodes- Are you planning on excavating this area in the future?
Cable - Yes, but I am not changing any elevations. The material I am removing. I put large boulders where the pool is going and I will remove those boulders and it will be tiered and landscaped.
Rhodes- At what height? In some essence you are creating retaining walls,; how high are these retaining walls in feet?
Cable - Less than six feet.
Cain - The pool is retaining itself?
Cable - Yes, it does retain itself.
Rhodes - For the retaining wall you need to submit plans for retaining walls.
Cable - It will not be any higher than the elevation at the point of the pool, it will not be higher than four feet. The material that will be removed from this area will be put to one side and once the pool is in place the level will be exactly the same as it is now.
Rhodes - If this plan that was submitted is in any condition as to site condition we would need to see it. There is a lot of confusing material in front of us. We can't make a decision until we see the site.
Ferman - One thing would be to hall the material off site.
Rhodes- Is Ralph Mastromonico engineering this?
Cable - As you can see Ralph Mastromonico did the site plan. Tell me what you want and I can call him and he can give you the information you need.
O'Connor - I suggest that you ignore the previous plans and work off the most recent plans that were submitted to you. He is proposing to build a pool and there was an old plan that showed the pool area however, when the original application went before the Board it did not show the pool, although he wanted it included. It could have been an oversight.
Cable - I am going to put the blame on my part. There is a plan filed with the village and fortunately when Dan O'Connor, Village Engineer took the time to go thru all the plans with me we found out it was not the proper plan. So here I am.
Greenbaum- I understand the pool area is already staked out. I suggest we have a site visit and adjourn the hearing until the next meeting on December 15, 2004.
Rhodes - What is this rectangular area here……(referring to plans)
Cable - A tomato garden.
O'Connor - I would like to see additional yard drains and fencing for the pool. I would also like to see additional deck elevations to see how drains are sloped; hopefully away from the pool.
Ferman - It will be a gravel basin and it will divert to a drywell.
Mark - The drywell overflows and there is no current plan to take the excess of three hundred gallons of chlorinated water that will have to peculate.
Eng. - it will be gravel basin and divert to drywell.
O'Connor - You show one yard drain into the drywell. I would like see more.
Cable - Our system has thirty percent less chlorine than years ago it is done with copper and silver mineral sanitizer.
Goldfarb - What is the chemical composition of the modifier?
Cable - I can get that for you.
O'Connor - You are going to put a filter in the pool and separation tank and then it will return to the pool and then it will be disposed of as solid waste. You don't ever drain the pool completely.
Goldfarb - Why does it have to go in the buffer zone as opposed to going somewhere else?
O'Connor- Maybe it is due to the elevations.
Cable - Naturally you would need to dig the pool deeper to pump it.
Goldfarb - Let's say the drywell is at a higher elevation; can it be pumped into the higher elevation?
Ferman - It can be pumped higher but knowing the site I can't picture a place to put it.
O'Connor - Are you proposing a drain at the bottom to drain the pool?
Ferman - No
Goldfarb - So any water taken out you would need the pool pumped?.
Ferman - You can pump it from the filter or you could install PVC and hard pipe it to the drywell.
Goldfarb - so it does not sound impossible
O'Connor - It would be good to move the drywell uphill if possible.
Cable - My north east corner was the closest to rock. I don't know what is here…(referring to plans).
Discussion followed over plans
Cable - I already have a three hundred gallon drywell in place.
Discussion followed over proposed location of drywell over plans.
Goldfarb - Referring to proposed plans…I wonder if it can be redesigned or reshaped to make it happen.
Cable - I assume you want it rotated ninety degrees. The only problem is I have a one thousand gallon propane tank that supplies my home. It is steeper here …(referring to plans).
Over plans the applicant further discussed options for resituating the drywell.
Rhodes - Where on this picture is your propane tank?
Cable - It is in the area of the chimney, it is buried.
Rhodes - Are you heating the pool?
Cable - Yes. I might do it solar or use a heat pump.
Rhodes - Will you use the source you use for the house?
Cable I will use electric. I use propane for the house. We decided the heat pump would be best.
Goldfarb - How do you plan to landscape?
Cable - My house is fully landscaped and beautifully manicured and I spent a lot of time on erosion control. The Boulders that I put there for this I will put aside and grade it so it will be slowly tiered with evergreens, juniper, pacasandra, and grass.
Goldfarb - Will you ever use fertilizer?
Cable - No. I have all natural perennial gardens.
O'Connor - I will draft a letter stating what I need in the plans.
The Board agreed to contact the applicant to set up a date and time for each member to inspect the site.
Hearing adjourned until December 15, 2004.
Barbara Hart, Located at 44 Lounsbury Road. Designated on the Tax Maps of the Village as Section 67.16 Block 2 Lot 34. Request for a Wetlands Activity Permit with respect to a proposed addition and garage.
Barbara Hart appeared at the hearing with her husband, Joseph slakes & Lunz and Shawn Brown, Architect*.
Ms.Hart stated that she is proposing an addition and garage and the plans submitted for the building permit application did not meet the setback requirements. The original
structure does not meet the requirements. Ms. Harts husband and Shawn Brown, Engineer, Slakes & Luntz Engineering Firm attended the hearing.
A Display Board was submitted by the applicants engineer for the Boards review.
Robert Luntz - There area some photos in the back of the application of the model of the proposed project (Submitted this evening). Towards the back is a model of the house that currently bridges over the stream. The portion of the house nearest Lounsbury was constructed in the seventies and the tee shaped portion. The unusual architecture of the house created a sensation and it was featured in the Architectural Digest. In 1973 there was an enclosed pool added. That pool is fully enclosed within the outline of the house. Basically, the house is a small house and no longer meets the needs of our client . We are proposing to extend the living space; the kitchen, living room and dining room that will be in the area of the existing footprint. There will also be an addition of a bedroom and a separate
building which will be the garage. The separate building has a carport and originally when we spoke to the owners we discussed expanding the kitchen in this area in order to take advantage of the fact that it is near the steam and ultimately looking at the things you are concerned with and anything in that area would have added to the nonconformity and violate the setback requirements. We wanted to accomplish adding bedrooms to the house and move away from the prohibited buffer zone. All of the proposed addition will be connected to the house. The driveway that comes off of Lounsbury is awkward and the proposal is to reposition it on the other side of the stream and enter off of Giglio. This will accomplish their desire to have a garage on the property and to clean up the problem with their driveway on Lounsbury. We will remove the carport cover on Lounsbury and plant the driveway with native plantings and bring it back to a natural state. With
respect to the proposed driveway, there is an existing curb cut on Giglio. There were two separate lots that were consolidated into this one property. We would like to take advantage of the existing curb cut. There is a fairly significant elevation difference which is called Elevation 205 on the plans. The intention is to slide down and along the slope to get to a level that is a reasonable amount above the entry level, but not on top of the hill.
Discussion followed over plans.
Luntz - The area for the driveway happens about half a level from where you enter the house; rather than having to climb up an area from where you will park and when guests come.. There is a retaining wall that will accomplish the stepping down as you come down from the house. We are proposing to remove three trees and they have all been marked and numbered on the plans. Any contaminants that will happen along the driveway will go into the dry wells and swails to catch it. We would like to use some kind of perforated material.
Rhodes - Perforated like concrete block?
Applicants Engineer - Not concrete block; it should be permeable.
Dan O'Connor - For mitigation it is hard to police in the future. If they paved it the drywells would have to be there anyway to take care of that.
Mrs Hart- My husband and I researched that and there is a cost concern because the materials are new and not that widely manufactured.. If we can afford it that is what we will do.
Rhodes - Will there still be any sort of path ?
Ferman - There will be a natural path and landscaping, but that has not been worked out yet.
Rhodes- I think you would want one because if I were going for a walk I would not want to have to …
Rhodes- Does the stream go directly under the house and how does it fair during our large storms?
Joseph Hart- It does build up during a storm but it has never overflowed. We purchased the house after Hurricane Floyd and the previous owner said no water at all came into the house.
Rhodes - Kaplins pond flows into this, will there be some check ……?
O'Connor - He will be lower than the pond; two feet six inches. There are future plans for downstream flooding that will be included in the Bartilucci Plans. The existing house is already in the buffer area, so no matter what he does he will need a Wetlands Activity Permit.
Rhodes - He currently has a septic tank and existing drain fields which is also in the activity area. What is the square footage of the existing house?
Ferman - 3,600 sq. ft.
Rhodes -And you are adding fourteen hundred square feet and your total lot is two lots so it is like ….
Ferman - Two and one half acres.
Mrs. Hart - It is two separate building lots.
O'Connor - Suggested they file the proper paperwork to merge the two lots, since the work they are proposing will extend into the other lot..
Rhodes - I noticed there were many dead trees in this area.
Ferman - They will be addressed ……
Mrs. Hart - They also pose a threat during snow storms.
Rhodes - The septic you are enlarging so I think you….
O'Connor - That has been cleared with the health department.
Greenbaum - What is the plan for catching the water that runs off the roof?
Ferman - Yes. There is a plan for that.
Greenbaum - When you demolish the existing carport what is the remediation plans so it does not go into the prohibited zone?
Ferman - Hay Bails already shown on plans.
Discussion followed over plans.
Greenbaum - Any other questions or comments?
There was no reply
Hearing Closed
Greenbaum - Made Motion to grant the application as submitted and with the following conditions:
1. Subject to engineers approval of the drywells.
2. Remediation plans such as Hay Bails and silt fencing
3. Applicant will file the necessary paperwork to merge the two lots, since the proposed construction will be extending into the second lot..
4. Planting will be done according to plans submitted.
Motion - to grant
Cain - Second the Motion
Vote: 5-0 - All in Favor Greenbaum, Cain, Goldfarb, Stern, Rhodes
NEW BUSINESS:
Hudson National Monitoring Report:
Greenbaum - We the WCC have been asked to respond to the recommendations that were made at the last section of the Report:
Rhodes - Mark has my comments.
Daniel O'Connor - Stated that the golf course is coming to the end of the sampling reports that were established for the phosphorous and nitrogen levels. Some of the sampling levels have stared to exceed the required levels and have raised some concern. Mr. O'Connor, stated that he did not think that Hudson National would object to the continuing of the testing so we can test and check the use of fertilizers. The pesticide sampling has been satisfactory and is being discontinued per the original plan. There are a couple of consultants involved, Environmental Turf Services for the reports and Bruce Donohue who is involved with the planting plans.
Rhodes - That is what I expected, that they would continue testing.
Rhodes - Why is it that Harris does not want testing?
O'Connor - If a homeowner does not want testing, we will not push the issue that is their rights.
Rhodes - I visited the Carl Stein property on Saturday and he mentioned that there is run-off and he said the water is foamy and that is indicative of nitrogen.
O'Connor - It is also indicative of natural organic material. Nitrogen is mainly salt. Even if you had very high levels, it would not affect the foaminess in the water. None of the levels are any concern to the drinking waters. These are levels one and level ten is a concern. The planning board is supporting the recommendations.
Greenbaum - The Water Control Commission was very much involved with the approval process of Hudson National, so I understand why we are copied on this and we were heavily involved in the analysis.
Greenbaum - Made Motion to support the recommendations.
Cain - Second the Motion
Vote: 5-0 - All In Favor
UPDATING OF CODES:
Dan O'Connor, Village Engineer - Fredrick P. Clark has been hired to update the Steep Slopes Code, Wetlands Environmental Site Plans and whatever else needs to be revised in the Code and there will be a whole review process. Most of the current Codes were established in 1986, so they need to be updated. During the process of updating they will be looking at the administrative and technical recommendations. They will also be reviewing Location Maps and Area Maps and certain scales to use. I would recommend that the Board review the regulations and make note of any concerns or suggestions you may have. The process will take approximately nine months to one year. The objective is not to miss anything when we are done. This will take a lot of work, but in the long run it will be very beneficial.
Greenbaum - Will they look at our authority in …..
O'Connor - Do you mean with respect to legislative intent?
Greenbaum - Our powers.
Goldfarb - Such as recommending a fine.
O'Connor - Fines would come through my office if anyone is in violation of any of the regulations. If that does not work we will then issue an appearance ticket and the Judge will make the ultimate determination.
Greenbaum - Whether we have authority to grant a permit within the twenty foot prohibited area.
O'Connor - Certainly in the 100 foot minimum activity setback you would be issuing permits.
There were no other comments.
Meeting closed
Respectfully submitted
Janice Fuentes
WCC Secretary
11/17/04
RESOLUTION
Barbara Hart has applied to the Village of Croton-on-Hudson, for a Wetlands Activity Permit with respect to a proposed addition and garage.
The property, 44 Lounsbury Rd., is designated on the Tax Maps of the Village as Section 67.16 Block 2 Lot 34.
A public hearing having been held on May 5, 2004 and after due notice made the following determination:
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the application is GRANTED as follows.
Greenbaum - Made Motion to grant the application as submitted and with the following conditions:
5. Subject to engineers approval of the drywells.
6. Remediation plans such as Hay Bails and silt fencing
7. Applicant will file the necessary paperwork to merge the two lots, since the proposed construction will be extending into the second lot..
8. Planting will be done according to plans submitted.
Motion - to grant
Cain - Second the Motion
Vote: 5-0 - All in Favor Greenbaum, Cain, Goldfarb, Stern, Rhodes
11/17/04
RESOLUTION
Barbara Hart has applied to the Village of Croton-on-Hudson, for a Wetlands Activity Permit with respect to a proposed addition and garage.
The property, 44 Lounsbury Rd., is designated on the Tax Maps of the Village as Section 67.16 Block 2 Lot 34.
A public hearing having been held on May 5, 2004 and after due notice made the following determination:
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the application is GRANTED as follows.
Greenbaum - Made Motion to grant the application as submitted and with the following conditions:
9. Subject to engineers approval of the drywells.
10. Remediation plans such as Hay Bails and silt fencing
11. Applicant will file the necessary paperwork to merge the two lots, since the proposed construction will be extending into the second lot..
12. Planting will be done according to plans submitted.
Motion - to grant
Cain - Second the Motion
Vote: 5-0 - All in Favor Greenbaum, Cain, Goldfarb, Stern, Rhodes
11/17/04
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